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May 22, 2018 at 23:25 comment added Joshua I think the edit made it more offensive not less.
May 22, 2018 at 16:14 comment added Mark Amery @JacobH Eh, what? By "karma" do you mean Reputation? But Meta doesn't have Reputation, so...
May 22, 2018 at 8:55 history edited gnat
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May 22, 2018 at 5:20 comment added Martin James @PeterMortensen lol, as if anyone here is likely to fall for bait that:)
May 21, 2018 at 16:12 comment added Peter Mortensen Why does Stack Overflow promote condescension towards beginners in the name of quality?
May 21, 2018 at 14:13 comment added Jean-François Fabre Mod talk about the Larsen effect...
May 21, 2018 at 14:05 comment added duplode @JacobH Elected moderators aren't subject to recall or term limits, so it boils down to roughly the same thing.
May 21, 2018 at 13:59 answer added Stephen C timeline score: -1
May 21, 2018 at 13:52 comment added Jacob H @duplode SO employees are not elected so your point is kind of moot.
May 21, 2018 at 13:39 comment added duplode @JacobH "Why are there moderators if they need to be moderated by the general populace?" -- At some level, there should be moderation of moderators by the general populace, assuming that we leave out the alternative of despotic rule.
May 21, 2018 at 13:37 comment added Nicol Bolas @JacobH: Oh boo hoo. I could not care less about how he said it, and his statement was directed at my idea. The disconcerting part about his post is something no edit can change: that an SO employee has such an alien viewpoint of the behavior of the site he works for. That edit won't change the fact that he genuinely believes that helping people is more important than building a quality knowledgebase of information.
May 21, 2018 at 13:35 comment added Jacob H Ah so even worse, an employee who sets a bad example and the rest of us need to clean up his mess, and also try to change the culture at the same time. What a task the volunteers on this site have!
May 21, 2018 at 13:32 comment added Nicol Bolas @JacobH: To be fair, Nick is not a moderator; he's an SO employee. By default, they have moderator powers on SO, but moderating is not his job.
May 21, 2018 at 13:29 comment added Jacob H @duplode Why are there moderators if they need to be moderated by the general populace?
May 21, 2018 at 13:20 comment added duplode @JacobH Absolutely not. It is not appropriate to pour gasoline on the fire, no matter how strongly you feel like protesting. Don't disrupt the site to make a point. (On a more procedural note, if anyone wonders what the multiple comments mentioning "garbage" are talking about, the edit history is easily available as usual.)
May 21, 2018 at 13:09 comment added Jacob H @duplode On the contrary, I think the rollback was 100% appropriate. The edit hides the terrible answer by a site admin. This should be front and center. The whole "Be Nice" doesn't seem to apply to moderators or people with high rep. SO has an attitude problem and I don't think it's new users.
May 21, 2018 at 0:54 comment added Travis J Mountain, meet molehill.
May 20, 2018 at 20:28 comment added Erik A @Martin meh, writing an entire answer is different than writing a comment. And being a stack overflow employee is different than being an average user. Calling this behavior out is appropriate, imo (though according to the latest results on my latest meta question, it should all be anonymized)
May 20, 2018 at 17:28 comment added Mark Amery @MikeMcCaughan He's an employee; there's no special symbol for them beyond the normal mod diamond. See his bio at twitter.com/fody.
May 20, 2018 at 16:23 comment added Heretic Monkey Is Nick Larsen an employee? I thought they got SO icons next to their names in addition to the diamond. I think Nick's just an elected moderator, but I could be wrong...
May 20, 2018 at 14:23 comment added Martin James It's meta - who cares? It's a comment on the discussion point. It's not like calling the poster a troll, (meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/262791/…). and/or bigot, (meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/262791/…), is it?
May 20, 2018 at 13:52 comment added TylerH @MartijnPieters Yeah, Journeyman Geek mentioned it on Tavern on the Meta when I pinged Tim Post about it. The rename to SO was apparently just informal internal naming.
May 20, 2018 at 13:48 comment added Martijn Pieters Mod @TylerH: at best, the rename was never consistent. The footer of this page uses Stack Exchange, Inc..
May 20, 2018 at 13:25 comment added Polygnome @MarkAmery I think you hit the nail on the head with that comment.
May 20, 2018 at 13:22 comment added Martijn Pieters Mod @TylerH: I know, but the OP used SE, Inc. to refer to the company, so I used the same term here.
May 20, 2018 at 13:22 comment added Polygnome @TylerH The privacy policy states "Stack Exchange, Inc."
May 20, 2018 at 13:21 comment added Mark Amery @Polygnome I'm not sure you've actually handled it badly; it's labelled as an "Uncharitable" tl;dr for a reason. Maybe this thread will turn out to be useful, despite my cynicism. I'm just skeptical, because all these conversations so far have produced a lot of anger and confusion and bitterness and uncertainty and misunderstanding without even a single tiny moment that I've seen of anyone gaining new insight or a new understanding of each others' views, nor any actionable ideas being produced. I don't see much reason to expect the output of revisiting this post to be any different.
May 20, 2018 at 13:21 comment added TylerH @MartijnPieters BTW the company name is Stack Overflow, not Stack Exchange. They changed it back a year or two ago.
May 20, 2018 at 13:20 vote accept Polygnome
May 20, 2018 at 13:19 answer added Martijn PietersMod timeline score: 38
May 20, 2018 at 13:17 comment added Polygnome @MarkAmery Maybe you are right in a way, because I am angry about both the blog post and much of the nonsense that has followed it.. duplode has already rolled back the offending words. How should I have handled this better? Custom flag to explain the rollback that had taken place?
May 20, 2018 at 13:15 comment added Martijn Pieters Mod The flag was marked disputed by a SO moderator. Decisions by Stack Overflow should never be taken as official SE, Inc. policy. We are our own people.
May 20, 2018 at 13:11 comment added Mark Amery Uncharitable tl;dr: "I see that the bitter culture war conflict that swept Stack Overflow for weeks is winding down but RARRR I am still angry so let's fight more!". Yes, Nick's post was hypocritical. Yes, it goes against the values of the Stack Overflow community (or at least the Meta-using section of it), and against straightforward utilitarianism, by arguing that we should hand-hold askers through their problems with no regard to the harm that the resulting low-quality artifacts will do to future searchers. Yes, it annoyed me, and 125 other people. But all this has already been said.
May 20, 2018 at 13:11 comment added Nick is tired Well part of it is to due with this being meta, all policies including the be nice policy are much more relaxed because there's meant to be more open, honest, discussion. There are far more offensive things happening on the site to care about someone saying something is "total garbage".
May 20, 2018 at 13:08 comment added Patrice Can I say what I thought of that answer when I saw it? Or as a non diamond user I'll get negative feedback because it'll be rude?...
May 20, 2018 at 13:06 comment added Polygnome @duplode Thanks - but that does not explain why an employee of SE, Inc thought this was a good idea in the first place, nor does it explain why the flag was not acted upon swiftly. That is why I am saying moderation here is running around in circles - we seem to have completely lost the focus on whats actually important to the site.
May 20, 2018 at 13:04 comment added duplode Tangential (but relevant) note: the answer had been edited on May 2 to give it less aggressive tone, but the edit was rolled back on May 7. The May 7 rollback was completely inappropriate, as it served no purpose other than inviting a bonus episode of the soap opera.
May 20, 2018 at 12:55 history asked Polygnome CC BY-SA 4.0