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Catija
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That said, I strongly reject the idea of an automated warning being sent to a user for this. If the likelihood of a comment being incorrectly validated as rude/abusive was low - or if there were a way to change the flag validation after the fact, it'd be one thing but the default moderator UI - particularly when viewing comments on posts - makes it very easy to accidentally validate a rude/abusive comment flag just by deleting the comment. - if they're viewing the post directly, the moderator may not know the comment was flagged at all!

###For those who aren't moderators -

Moderators have two ways to view flags

  • on the post directly with a hover bar bottom-locked to the page (the "waffle bar").
  • on the active flags page which gives the content of the flagged comment and title of the post it's on.

The latter is often used but may be somewhat lacking in context. My personal preference is to go to the post but we don't have the volume that SO does.

When a comment is flagged, moderators can either delete a comment, edit it, or dismiss the flag. Unless the comment is otherwise valuable but has minor issues, we're unlikely to edit it. We can not validate a comment flag without first deleting itthe comment - we can later undelete it if we feel like it, though this is rare in my experience.

That said, I strongly reject the idea of an automated warning being sent to a user for this. If the likelihood of a comment being incorrectly validated as rude/abusive was low - or if there were a way to change the flag validation after the fact, it'd be one thing but the default moderator UI - particularly when viewing comments on posts - makes it very easy to accidentally validate a rude/abusive comment flag just by deleting the comment.

###For those who aren't moderators -

When a comment is flagged, moderators can either delete a comment, edit it, or dismiss the flag. Unless the comment is otherwise valuable but has minor issues, we're unlikely to edit it. We can not validate a comment flag without first deleting it - we can later undelete it if we feel like it, though this is rare in my experience.

That said, I strongly reject the idea of an automated warning being sent to a user for this. If the likelihood of a comment being incorrectly validated as rude/abusive was low - or if there were a way to change the flag validation after the fact, it'd be one thing but the default moderator UI - particularly when viewing comments on posts - makes it very easy to accidentally validate a rude/abusive comment flag just by deleting the comment - if they're viewing the post directly, the moderator may not know the comment was flagged at all!

###For those who aren't moderators -

Moderators have two ways to view flags

  • on the post directly with a hover bar bottom-locked to the page (the "waffle bar").
  • on the active flags page which gives the content of the flagged comment and title of the post it's on.

The latter is often used but may be somewhat lacking in context. My personal preference is to go to the post but we don't have the volume that SO does.

When a comment is flagged, moderators can either delete a comment, edit it, or dismiss the flag. Unless the comment is otherwise valuable but has minor issues, we're unlikely to edit it. We can not validate a comment flag without first deleting the comment - we can later undelete it if we feel like it, though this is rare in my experience.

noted age of IPS and added explanation to automatic flag section
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Catija
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  • I'm not a SO user.
  • I'm a moderator on two sites including Interpersonal Skills which, in the time it's existed until now (~9 months), has had over 15K comments deleted. This is nothing on SO scale but I think I know a bit about comments.
  • I'm posting here because

The automatic flag should absolutely stay - it's very useful and I'd propose a second automatic flag to pair with it. As I noted, on IPS we delete many comments and many comments are flagged. Sometimes, often, the users who have flaggedtheir comments flagged as "No"no longer needed" are just as much in need of a written warning about their chatty comments. This is particularly the case as the opposite of what I mentioned above often happens, too.

If users don't understand the comment policy on a site (or the network) it's helpful to give moderators a poke rather than expecting us to recognize "repeat offenders" for chatty or unnecessary comments. Yes, this could trigger some false positives for users who merely comment a lot in a helpful way and have those comments flagged once they've served their purpose, but I think this would be rare and the trigger could easily be adjusted to something that meets the needs of the site.

In addition to this, it's worth noting that the number of comments flagged compared to the number deleted is pretty different, at least on IPS. We have deleted over 15K comments but only about 5K of those were flagged, which means that, for us anyway, 2/3rds of our rude or NLN comments were never reported to us.

Often this is because users will flag a single comment or the post it's on to say "the comments here can be removed" or we're alerted to a huge comment volume by the "more than 20 comments in three days" auto flag ... but other times it's a matter of a moderator seeing the comments before they're flagged (this is probably less common on SO).

  • I'm not a SO user.
  • I'm a moderator on two sites including Interpersonal Skills which, in the time it's existed until now, has had over 15K comments deleted. This is nothing on SO scale but I think I know a bit about comments.
  • I'm posting here because

The automatic flag should absolutely stay - it's very useful and I'd propose a second automatic flag to pair with it. As I noted, on IPS we delete many comments and many comments are flagged. Sometimes, often, the users who have flagged comments as "No longer needed" are just as much in need of a written warning about their chatty comments. This is particularly the case as the opposite of what I mentioned above often happens, too.

If users don't understand the comment policy on a site (or the network) it's helpful to give moderators a poke rather than expecting us to recognize "repeat offenders" for chatty or unnecessary comments. Yes, this could trigger some false positives for users who merely comment a lot in a helpful way and have those comments flagged once they've served their purpose, but I think this would be rare and the trigger could easily be adjusted to something that meets the needs of the site.

  • I'm not a SO user.
  • I'm a moderator on two sites including Interpersonal Skills which, in the time it's existed until now (~9 months), has had over 15K comments deleted. This is nothing on SO scale but I think I know a bit about comments.
  • I'm posting here because

The automatic flag should absolutely stay - it's very useful and I'd propose a second automatic flag to pair with it. As I noted, on IPS we delete many comments and many comments are flagged. Sometimes, often, the users who have their comments flagged as "no longer needed" are just as much in need of a written warning about their chatty comments. This is particularly the case as the opposite of what I mentioned above often happens, too.

If users don't understand the comment policy on a site (or the network) it's helpful to give moderators a poke rather than expecting us to recognize "repeat offenders" for chatty or unnecessary comments. Yes, this could trigger some false positives for users who merely comment a lot in a helpful way and have those comments flagged once they've served their purpose, but I think this would be rare and the trigger could easily be adjusted to something that meets the needs of the site.

In addition to this, it's worth noting that the number of comments flagged compared to the number deleted is pretty different, at least on IPS. We have deleted over 15K comments but only about 5K of those were flagged, which means that, for us anyway, 2/3rds of our rude or NLN comments were never reported to us.

Often this is because users will flag a single comment or the post it's on to say "the comments here can be removed" or we're alerted to a huge comment volume by the "more than 20 comments in three days" auto flag ... but other times it's a matter of a moderator seeing the comments before they're flagged (this is probably less common on SO).

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Catija
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I'm going to preface this answer a bit with some information about myself:

  • I'm not a SO user.
  • I'm a moderator on two sites including Interpersonal Skills which, in the time it's existed until now, has had over 15K comments deleted. This is nothing on SO scale but I think I know a bit about comments.
  • I'm posting here because
  1. Many things that get implemented on SO eventually end up being implemented network-wide.
  2. I have some ideas that might help.

Now that's out of the way...


The indication I've gotten about Stack Overflow (and much of the SE network, to be honest) is that it's easy and friendly if you've gotten past your first few good questions/answers but the learning curve is steep and the users who respond to your posts (if anyone does) may be somewhat tired of dealing with new users who don't understand how to ask a good question or write a good answer.

I completely understand that. It's difficult to, day after day, run into the same sorts of errors and not start to wish that everyone couldn't just do better at knowing what to do. It's difficult to remember that each new user is (probably) new and hasn't run into a site like SO before with so much rigor and expectations from their questions.

It seems there's work being done to find ways to help educate new users before they're able to post their first question or answers - speed bumps, if you will. This may not alleviate the issue entirely, but (hopefully) it will reduce it... so, on the assumption that there's movement in that direction...

##How can we help users who are regularly getting comments flagged as rude or abusive understand that what they're doing isn't OK and that it needs to change?

Suggestion: Can users be sent an automatic warning with a reminder to Be Nice if a number of their comments are flagged as rude? (3 in a week? 5 in a month? Recommendations welcome.)

As others have said, after three validated rude comments in a week, an autoflag is created by the system to alert the mods that they may have some work to do. This autoflag is helpful. I've seen it several times on IPS. It's a valuable flag.

That said, I strongly reject the idea of an automated warning being sent to a user for this. If the likelihood of a comment being incorrectly validated as rude/abusive was low - or if there were a way to change the flag validation after the fact, it'd be one thing but the default moderator UI - particularly when viewing comments on posts - makes it very easy to accidentally validate a rude/abusive comment flag just by deleting the comment.

###For those who aren't moderators -

When a comment is flagged, moderators can either delete a comment, edit it, or dismiss the flag. Unless the comment is otherwise valuable but has minor issues, we're unlikely to edit it. We can not validate a comment flag without first deleting it - we can later undelete it if we feel like it, though this is rare in my experience.

In some cases a user may incorrectly flag a comment as rude/abusive - perhaps the moderator simply disagrees or perhaps it's a matter of interpretation or someone is doing it will ill intent - but a comment not being rude/abusive doesn't make it not delete-worthy. So, a moderator going through dozens of comment flags (as I understand is often the case on SO) may see that comment is flagged but not with what reason. They agree it should be deleted, it's deleted and the flag is automatically validated, regardless of the reason.

If a moderator is paying attention, and they notice that the comment should be removed but the flag should be declined, it becomes a two-step process that requires going to the post to manage.

There are user scripts that help with this but errors are still possible. As such, if something that sends automatic moderator messages was considered, I suggest that it be set quite high to reduce the likelihood of errors causing it to be sent.


##A new automatic moderator flag

The automatic flag should absolutely stay - it's very useful and I'd propose a second automatic flag to pair with it. As I noted, on IPS we delete many comments and many comments are flagged. Sometimes, often, the users who have flagged comments as "No longer needed" are just as much in need of a written warning about their chatty comments. This is particularly the case as the opposite of what I mentioned above often happens, too.

Some users don't like using rude/abusive flags, even if a comment meets that description or, perhaps is borderline but not quite rude. This means that, unless a moderator chooses to manually flag the post as rude/abusive instead of validating a NLN flag, the count of rude comments may not be accurate. But surely, having 20 comments total in a week flagged might also be cause for moderator intervention?

If users don't understand the comment policy on a site (or the network) it's helpful to give moderators a poke rather than expecting us to recognize "repeat offenders" for chatty or unnecessary comments. Yes, this could trigger some false positives for users who merely comment a lot in a helpful way and have those comments flagged once they've served their purpose, but I think this would be rare and the trigger could easily be adjusted to something that meets the needs of the site.


A couple of people have suggested that letting people know when their comments are deleted would be a good intermediate step.

I'm sorry, but I have a really difficult time taking this suggestion seriously. Users already complain when their not rude comments are deleted or moved to chat. In an informal poll of my own personal moderation experience, I've found that telling them (in a comment) that comments were removed is a great way to start an argument about their comments where they attempt to explain in great detail why their comments weren't rude and how people are too sensitive and...

Yeah. Please, no.


##What else might help?

A default moderator message template that actually applies only to rude/abusive comments and doesn't address arguments would be really useful to me. We have a generic "Abusive to others" one and one for "Arguments in comments" but neither of these really address single comments that don't start discussions. We can absolutely edit the default ones but if we want to encourage sending these mod messages, the easiest way to do that is to make it easier on the moderators - give us a default that doesn't imply that the person who wrote the comments was "wronged" or that the mod message might be in error.