Timeline for Is it on-topic to ask a question about protocol irrespective of its programming usage?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
35 events
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Jun 3, 2020 at 15:29 | history | edited | CommunityBot |
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Oct 4, 2018 at 10:19 | vote | accept | Amit Joshi | ||
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:26 | comment | added | Dan Bron | @AmitJoshi No, by definition, if they’re closed they’re off-topic. The whole point of making an argument that something is on-topic is so it won’t be closed. If it’s closed it can’t receive answers. The examples you’ve given will all be closed and will be barred from receiving answers. If you want them to remain open, try your hardest, on your own, before asking, to answer them for yourself. If you still can’t find the answer you need, write up the question, detail all the research you did, where you looked, what you found, what you didn’t find, and what specific doubts still remain. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:24 | comment | added | yivi | @Oleg, reading the linked page, I think it does say that the other close reasons also put the question in "off-topic" territory. That was my understanding anyway. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:22 | comment | added | Oleg | @yivi Not if you're consistent with your definitions, off-topic as defined by SO is only one of the close reasons. stackoverflow.com/help/closed-questions | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:19 | answer | added | S.L. Barth is on codidact.com | timeline score: 5 | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:19 | comment | added | yivi | I thought that closable questions were by definition off-topic (with the exception of dupes). "Some questions are still off-topic, even if they fit into one of the categories listed above" | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:15 | comment | added | Amit Joshi | @DanBron: Ok; so those will be closed saying "unclear what you’re asking". Agreed. Does that mean they are still on-topic? | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:12 | comment | added | Dan Bron | @AmitJoshi In other words,beginner questions are ok, but lazy questions are not. Here is a much more famous and much more upvoted Q&A than the one you linked: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/261592/…. All questions must show your own effort and research before asking strangers on SO to volunteer their time to help you. This isn’t just an SO rule, it’s a basic courtesy of human interaction, and if you don’t follow it, the rudeness will upset people and furthermore your questions will be closed. Google, then ask | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:07 | comment | added | Dan Bron | @AmitJoshi This has nothing to do with code and everything to do with you doing your own basic legwork before asking experts on SO to volunteer their time to help you. It’s rude to ask someone else to do something you can easily do for yourself. On another site on the network, “English Language and Usage”, it is offtopic to ask “what does <word> mean”. Those questions are closed as “we are not an outsourced dictionary-reading service, go read the dictionary for yourself and come back with any remaining doubts”. It’s expected that you know that google and manuals exist & you use them b4 asking. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:07 | comment | added | Oleg |
meta.stackexchange.com/questions/10582/… Too broad: The question must be edited to limit it to a specific problem with enough detail to identify an adequate answer, and not ask multiple distinct questions at once. There is no specific problem hence too broad.
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Feb 12, 2018 at 12:04 | comment | added | Amit Joshi | @DanBron: “why do you need strangers on the internet to do your googling or your manual-reading tor you” I understand it now; thanks. But this answer says otherwise. All my examples fit the criteria (4 points) mentioned in that answer except third point. My examples do not contain code because those are purely for protocol. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:03 | comment | added | Dan Bron | @AmitJoshi This is the point. I have never heard of MLLP before never mind “enhanced mode”. I literally copied and pasted the words — your words — from example 3 into google, “What is enhanced mode in MLLP” and the very first hit was a precise explanation of exactly that topic: datica.com/academy/hl7-202-the-hl7-ack-acknowledgement-message/… . Given that, it’s not clear why you didn’t do that, or what about that link or the 15 that followed it in Google didn’t help, and so your Qs will be closed as off-topic “we don’t do googling or read manuals for you” aka unclear. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 12:01 | comment | added | Martin James | @AmitJoshi prolly. OK. I would leave it to those with the relevant skillset. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:59 | comment | added | Martin James | Myself, I would not bother either way with thoe examples - I'm not familiar with the protocols, so no action from me on tech. questions where I don't have tech, knowledge. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:59 | comment | added | Amit Joshi | 10-15 lines of insightful explanation with links to section in documentation for supporting an answer AND good online resource/article available if any. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:57 | comment | added | Martin James | 10-15 lines of insightful explanation, or 10-15 lines of text copied from the documentation/Google? | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:56 | comment | added | Dan Bron | @AmitJoshi I understand what you are saying but I think you did not understand what I said. The “unclear” reason isn’t used for just Qs which are unclear; SO merged several close reasons into that one reason a few years ago, and so now “unclear” is used more for “unclear why you’re asking”, aka “why do you need strangers on the internet to do your googling or your manual-reading tor you” aka “that’s answered in the documentation, to read that first and then come back to us with more specific Qs not answered by the documentation” aka “we are not a tutorial service” as Martin James put it. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:54 | comment | added | Amit Joshi | @Oleg: Example 2 and 3 can be very well answered in 10 to 15 lines. Why that will be too broad? But anyway, thanks you explicitly mentioned they are on topic. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:53 | comment | added | Amit Joshi | @DanBron: IMHO question will be very clear to experienced user in that protocol. He will clearly understand what OP is asking and why. If someone is not experienced in particular technology, I am not sure how he should treat that post. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:52 | comment | added | Oleg | IMO they are all on topic and should be closed as too broad. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:45 | comment | added | Dan Bron | That said, the way to rescue all 3 Qs is the same and it also straightforward: show us what you found in the manual/RFP/googling for this topic, and why it wasn’t sufficient to solve he problem. Don’t ask someone else to read the manual or google search for you. Do the basic legwork yourself, show your readers you did in the body of your Q itself, and tell them precisely where you’re hung up. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:44 | comment | added | Martin James | 'There is no tutorial request in question' yes, youre right - it's implied. Thanks for the examples, though. I will wait to see what those familiar with the protocols have to say:) | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:42 | comment | added | Dan Bron | I think all 3 examples have the same issue as the first TCP example, which Martin James points out. They’ll all be closed as “unclear what you’re asking”, as that reason is now used as a catch-all for “unclear why you’re asking”, aka “your question needs to demonstrate (a) a minimal understanding of the material you’re asking about and (b) that you’ve done the basic legwork for yourself and that’s evident in the Q”. We used to have specific close reasons for that but SO decided to merge them with “unclear”. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:39 | history | edited | Amit Joshi | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Feb 12, 2018 at 11:27 | comment | added | Amit Joshi | @MartinJames: IMHO down vote should be the way to express "not Googling or reading the RFC". There is no tutorial request in question title or body (question updated). As I mentioned in my question, I only want to know about being on-topic; not about other reasons mentioned by you. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:26 | history | edited | Amit Joshi | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Feb 12, 2018 at 11:23 | comment | added | Martin James | I can certainly imagine some protocol questions that may be on-topic. Maybe there is code and/or a state-table, and some desired behaviour that is troublesome to implement or testing reveals some obscure operation. Maybe.. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:19 | comment | added | Martin James | Yeah, TCP CLOSE_WAIT is a bad example and such a question would surely be closed as 'Too broad', 'Unclear' or 'tutorial request', (real reason - not Googling or reading the RFC). | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:11 | history | edited | Amit Joshi | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Feb 12, 2018 at 11:04 | history | edited | Amit Joshi | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Feb 12, 2018 at 11:03 | comment | added | yivi | Can you add more examples to your question, to better describe these other hypothetical protocols? | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:02 | comment | added | Amit Joshi | It might not be a network protocol. It might be other protocol that can be implemented using programming language. | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:01 | comment | added | yivi | networkengineering.stackexchange.com ? | |
Feb 12, 2018 at 11:00 | history | asked | Amit Joshi | CC BY-SA 3.0 |