Timeline for What can we put in a question template to help people ask better questions?
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Jun 3, 2020 at 15:29 | history | edited | CommunityBot |
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Nov 27, 2017 at 20:46 | history | edited | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Nov 24, 2017 at 17:40 | comment | added | Jon Ericson Staff | @jpmc26: I did, in fact, ask this question because of our conversation. But the general idea has been bubbling up in my mind for a few weeks (or maybe longer). I think there's a disconnect between the criteria most voters use on questions and the signal active users expect to get from score. These conversations are helping me understand that disconnect a bit better. | |
Nov 21, 2017 at 16:15 | history | edited | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Nov 21, 2017 at 5:04 | comment | added | jpmc26 | @JonEricson Of course, I'm ignoring the fact that some good quality questions are never upvoted and some (possibly many) poor quality questions receive a positive score. I don't know how much this evens out, and I don't know of a way to measure it. But the data certainly suggests that the odds of getting an answer even on a bad question aren't that bad. The cost of asking a bad question is also very low, so in a cost/benefit analysis, asking a bad question might even have a bigger probability of payoff for the effort involved. | |
Nov 21, 2017 at 4:54 | comment | added | jpmc26 | @JonEricson Also, have a more readable query. I took the liberty of looking at some additional calculations. Negative scoring question have an over 30% chance of getting answered; nonpositive scoring questions have an almost 50% chance. Nonpositive scoring questions comprise 60% of all answered questions and 70% of all questions. This shows that askers consider the odds for no effort questions to be very worth posting them. | |
Nov 21, 2017 at 3:45 | comment | added | jpmc26 | @JonEricson These questions are frequently upvoted or receive answers before I see them to downvote. Even I fall into the trap of trying to answer questions that have failed to clarify their needs occasionally. What's worse is that they virtually never go back and clarify once they start receiving answers, even when explicitly asked. I don't know how'd you'd even quantify that, but it's clear that voting, especially early voting, does not reflect quality that well. | |
Nov 21, 2017 at 2:46 | comment | added | Jon Ericson Staff | @jpmc26: So the data suggests downvoted questions are unlikely to get even one answer, much less several. If you want multiple answers, your best bet is to ask a question that gets upvoted. Of course, new users are not likely to understand this and some users aren't going to ask good questions no matter what. My point is there is untapped potential among users who would like to get answers, but just don't know how to ask. | |
Nov 20, 2017 at 23:26 | comment | added | jpmc26 | @JonEricson "The most selfish thing an asker can do is ask a question that will actually get a useful answer." I reject this premise. The most selfish thing a user can do is ask a low effort, crap question that a bunch of answerers have to guess about the details and they choose the one that happens to guess right about the final output. It is vastly less selfish to create a useful question that gives a good presentation of what their current understanding is and what they find confusing about it. Such a question also generates very useful answers. | |
Nov 3, 2017 at 15:23 | comment | added | ivan_pozdeev | @JarrodRoberson Not 100% of them. If even 20% will, that will already be a huge win. Currently, I see that many (most) newbies -- not help vampires, even those showing genuine effort -- honestly don't know what information to include for us to be able to answer. | |
Nov 3, 2017 at 14:41 | comment | added | user177800 | @ivan_pozdeev - put gibberish in all the fields and then delete the entire block of text is what will happen by the target audience this is trying to address. It is just a trivial speed bump for the least amount of effort help vampires. | |
Nov 2, 2017 at 16:37 | comment | added | ivan_pozdeev | I was also skeptic about the idea of a template that is both generic and useful enough... until I actually saw one in another answer. | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 18:29 | comment | added | Jon Ericson Staff | The most selfish thing an asker can do is ask a question that will actually get a useful answer. Of course many people will just ignore the template. (I expect many won't even bother to delete it.) But the thesis of this test is that a template might help a tiny portion of askers create good questions rather than bad ones. We've tried the silver bullet approach with little effect. Forcing users to do something different often results in users finding more innovative ways to cheat. | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 18:05 | history | edited | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Oct 31, 2017 at 17:59 | comment | added | user177800 | I can tell you the only reason you need to know why the template(s) no matter how many will be a waste of time. Human nature, which is P.C. for selfishness; dictates that the target audience will just delete the template text and do what they do now. Or if they are forced to enter in stuff into template fields will enter nonsense into any mandatory fields, kind of like the Titles are today, mostly garbage. Templates will not change behavior. You have to change the behavior to change the outcome. Forcing them to do something different forces a different behavior and thus outcome | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 17:52 | comment | added | Jon Ericson Staff | Correct. This is why we are collecting ideas for several different templates to A/B test. We're looking at just testing one template to start in order to verify the initial work. If that test is encouraging, we'll probably jump more quickly to a template selector. If it's not encouraging, we'll test a larger variety of templates (probably in parallel to save time). If templates don't work at all, testing will help us know why they don't work. We've long passed the point where intuition is a helpful guide to approaching this problem. | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 17:39 | comment | added | user177800 | scale model to full size are not any less absurd for more valid experiments either because of many reasons, the most important one is material physics. A single template test is nothing more than a single template test, it does not even begin to represent what a multiple template system would result in or how it would perform. Even more so, it does not even validate anything other than that single template that was picked performs. Maybe a different template would perform better or worse. That is why A/B/C testing exists. Single template == baby steps mentality and an invalid outcome. | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 17:16 | comment | added | Jon Ericson Staff | I think a better analogy is testing a scale model of a race car before building the actual car. I'm willing to be persuaded that a single template test is not representative of the self-categorization system you are suggesting. But it's not helping to jump to absurd arguments. | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 17:05 | history | edited | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Oct 31, 2017 at 16:58 | comment | added | user177800 | @JonEricson - "baby steps" in the wrong direction ( template ) is not going to provide any validation to a completely different solution. That is like saying you are going to learn how to ride a bicycle with training wheels and if successful you are going to race F1 cars. Actually "baby steps" always lead to failure, it is a process designed to prove failure not success. It is a process of "doing enough to fail and no more", in the 30 years I have been doing software development. | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 16:53 | history | edited | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Oct 31, 2017 at 16:49 | comment | added | Jon Ericson Staff | Fortunately, we are just doing a pilot test of one-size-fits-some templates. If the results are encouraging we're planning to build out something similar to what you suggest. I think it would be terribly shortsighted of us to ignore the volume of bad questions and so we are not. This very meta question is part of a defense-in-depth strategy we've pursued for years. (Please see: my answer to "Why are there so many bad question?") | |
Oct 31, 2017 at 13:55 | history | edited | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Oct 31, 2017 at 13:48 | history | edited | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Oct 31, 2017 at 13:39 | history | answered | user177800 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |