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Nov 6, 2017 at 10:38 comment added Lightness Races in Orbit @ImportanceOfBeingErnest: "I think we do not assume the majority of new users to be help vampires" Why not? They are.
Nov 4, 2017 at 18:23 comment added Passer By @ImportanceOfBeingErnest True, but then there are also so many people saying "I just need this to work". To echo l4mpi, I think the message have to be drove in, instead of just presented, as your last sentence implied
Oct 28, 2017 at 14:09 comment added Elin Notice that this page stackoverflow.com/questions/ask/advice does not mention MCVE, reiterate the kinds of topics that are or are not appropriate or say to summarize the research that you have done. Instead it states the obvious (search).
Oct 20, 2017 at 14:33 comment added ImportanceOfBeingErnest @l4mpi What makes me think that this is useful: All the comments that say "Thank you for the suggested readings, I will go through them." or similar after I have reminded them of looking through How to ask and MCVE below their question.
Oct 20, 2017 at 14:20 comment added l4mpi Well, driving lessons teach you to watch out for road signs, but every software or internet service teaches you to ignore mandatory checkboxes. We already have the exact thing you argue for literally everywhere where an EULA is involved and in many other places (e.g. "I have read the community rules thread before posting" in forums). And as is common knowledge, in all of these instances the overwhelming majority of users ignores the text and simply clicks the box to proceed. What makes you think that it would be any different on SO?
Oct 20, 2017 at 14:02 comment added ImportanceOfBeingErnest @l4mpi To take the picture from this comment and below, it seems you are arguing that a "dangerous bend" warning sign will not reduce the number of deadly accidents on a road. I strongly doubt that, since the majority of people have no intention of killing other people - they might just not be aware of the danger ahead. Putting up a warning sign is hence helpful.
Oct 20, 2017 at 13:45 comment added l4mpi I understood the question perfectly well. Your checkboxes reiterates things from the introduction page, so the people who actually read stuff have already read it, and the people who do not read stuff will just check it without reading anything to make it go away. "They would notice making a wrong statement", notice maybe, but you must be very naive to think they care. Just look at your average EULA, what you propose is basically the same as an "I have read and understood these terms" checkbox.
Oct 20, 2017 at 12:49 comment added ImportanceOfBeingErnest @l4mpi Maybe you have misunderstood the question, which is how to help users ask questions. I think we do not assume the majority of new users to be help vampires, and I think we can also assume that they would actually notice making a wrong statement by confirming having done something which they obviously haven't. But it should also be clear that if the site mirrors that it is ok to ask bad questions, the fear of doing something bad by making such wrong statement is heavily reduced - this is what the last paragraph is about.
Oct 20, 2017 at 12:08 comment added l4mpi +1 for the last sentence, -1 for the rest. Here's how the workflow of your typical help vampire would look like with your proposed checkboxes: 1) take screenshot of code, add image to question, click submit -> error! 2) type variations of "halp it not work" enough times so the error complaining about questions having to contain text to go away, click submit -> error! 3) notice red box around some checkboxes and text saying something about "mandatory", check all indicated checkboxes, click submit -> works 4) get upvotes and answers for the submitted trash because people want to "be nice"...
Oct 20, 2017 at 5:26 comment added Passer By Echoing @user1803551, there are all too many users that won't go through the tour and whatnot before asking (evident through their lack of badges). These people tend to post questions of the lowest quality
Oct 19, 2017 at 10:34 comment added ImportanceOfBeingErnest @JonEricson I guess the same applies to the page you link to: Remove the "improve your chances" and replace it with something definitive. I hope the main point of this got through though: Make a template according to the existing guide and improve the "problem description" part. (Btw. I do not get what the puppet wants to tell me. You do get reputation by answering bad questions and that is why people answer them, hence new bad questions are being asked. If you don't believe this to be the case, the measurement metrics you use might be off.)
Oct 19, 2017 at 1:53 comment added Funk Forty Niner @JonEricson Oh I see, thanks Jon. I've made a note of it and will be using that link (in the future) for new users and possibly some higher repped who could also (probably) use a refresher ;-) Cheers
Oct 19, 2017 at 1:51 comment added Jon Ericson Staff @Fred-ii-: It's been there for ages for users with less than 10 reputation. So you might not have seen it if you got an answer upvote before asking, if you joined very early or if you got the association bonus from reputation on some other site first.
Oct 19, 2017 at 1:10 comment added Funk Forty Niner @JonEricson In response to your: "One thing to note is that new users already go through this page to get to the form for writing their question." - Is that based on statistics? How is that known for certain? Or am I seeing a different link/view from the "Ask a question" button and seeing asking help » because of my rep? In either case, I doubt that (too) many don't bother reading what's on or off-topic, they just want "dah codez".
Oct 18, 2017 at 23:44 comment added user1803551 +Infinity for the last paragraph. On the topic of checkboxes, I think the asker will just tick whatever they need to get their question posted (like we do with agreeing to licenses). What happens if someone just blindly checks all boxes while not adhering to their content?
Oct 18, 2017 at 20:38 comment added Jon Ericson Staff One thing to note is that new users already go through this page to get to the form for writing their question. Maybe updating this page would be helpful, but it's not part of the scope of this project. As for the rewards system, I encourage you to try getting a sock puppet to 1k. Perhaps the most startling thing for me was to discover how hard it is to get an upvote. Answering questions (good or bad) is not an easy road to reputation riches.
Oct 18, 2017 at 14:36 comment added Funk Forty Niner I've been thinking about this for a long time, being if it's the staff working on the back end doing/writing up the content for the front end. Those two are totally different animals and feel they're not being treated as such :-) They have to remember where "they" came/started from and put themselves in a (new) coder's shoes for a while. Until that happens, it's going to remain the same 'ol, same 'ol. It's been said that Stack was put together by professionals, for professionals, yet the outlying problem is constantly about low quality posts by members who don't know how Stack rolls.
Oct 18, 2017 at 14:32 comment added ImportanceOfBeingErnest Yep, that's my first main point here. It is all there, just hidden. But it can be (re)used for any kind of template or UI.
Oct 18, 2017 at 14:28 comment added Funk Forty Niner "In principle the How to ask a good question guide has all the details in that are needed to ask a question, which can be answered." - Yes it does and I agree, but my take on this is, that the "front end" doesn't show enough. That yellow box on the right when they click on "ask a question", doesn't have enough (bulleted) points for them to read. It's simply not enough and isn't strict enough. The dev team needs to work on that, and has been neglected (not thought of enough) for too long.
Oct 18, 2017 at 14:14 history edited ImportanceOfBeingErnest CC BY-SA 3.0
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Oct 18, 2017 at 14:07 history answered ImportanceOfBeingErnest CC BY-SA 3.0