Timeline for Clarifying the assessment of a question when the community doesn't reach consensus
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
32 events
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Aug 2, 2017 at 5:07 | comment | added | user2371524 |
@SteveSummit looking at revisions 17 and 18 (17 was OP with his typo C11 vs C++11, 18 was someone else changing the meaning of the question), it's absolutely clear OP was trying to use C++11 auto . No ambiguity at all. But unfortunately, Olaf now managed to fool even a moderator into doing the wrong edit. I flagged this.
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Aug 1, 2017 at 19:45 | comment | added | Steve Summit | @Olaf I confess I did not follow the link. Having done so, I agree it's ambiguous at best. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 19:20 | comment | added | StoryTeller - Unslander Monica | @SteveSummit - You missed master 2.5 (if counting from 1 to 3). "Your question isn't clear to me, would you be so kind as to elaborate so I may better help you". | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 19:12 | comment | added | Steve Summit | A newbie approaches the pinnacle of wisdom and asks, "Oh masters, what is one plus too?" Quickendirty master promptly answers, "Threee!" Didactic master patiently explains, "Did you mean 'one plus two'? That's three. 'too' isn't even a number, although it is a homophone for 'two'." But then there's also Pedantic master, who is muttering "Your question makes no sense. It isn't even grammatical. We can't answer it until you fix it." | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 19:07 | comment | added | StoryTeller - Unslander Monica | @Olaf - This isn't about the expression, it's about the OP expecting the variable to be float too. We would also mince less words if some other users give up their passive aggressiveness and holier than thou attitude. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 19:05 | comment | added | too honest for this site |
@StoryTeller: The expression does evaluate to float ! That's stated at the linked cppreference page, which is about C, not C++. Seems we could have saved a lot of time if certain users had followed that link and actually read the page.
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Aug 1, 2017 at 19:01 | comment | added | too honest for this site | @SteveSummit: Did you even follow that link to cppreference? Or read my comment carefully? That link is about C only. cppreference has info for both languages! Oh, and gcc compiles this just with a warning even with pedantic set. Sure, beginners never ignore warnings … | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 18:38 | comment | added | StoryTeller - Unslander Monica | @Olaf - "Evidence is ignored"? That's rich. Did you not notice the "I expected this to be float as said here <insert wrong link>". That's expected C++11 behavior to anyone with even basic knowledge of the standard. The only one who is ignoring evidence is you. Pot calling the kettle black, honestly. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 18:10 | comment | added | Steve Summit |
The question was obviously a C++ question. (1) tagged [c++]. (2) mentioned cppreference.com. (3) Presented a code fragment that was clearly (if confusingly) trying to explore the new C++11 usage of auto . You can only believe it was originally a C question if you believe (a) someone still uses auto in C and (b) threw it in as the world's biggest red herring in an utterly uninteresting question about ordinary float->int truncation in C, and that badly strains Occam's Razor!
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Aug 1, 2017 at 17:55 | comment | added | user2371524 | Good bye, have a nice day. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:54 | comment | added | too honest for this site | I'm out of this kindergarten! Apparently high reps is not a sign of being able to apply Occam's razor or really discussing. You are just stating your position, no arguments, no evidence. Evidence I brought up is ignored; worse: the question is edited just to match your position. Mutilate the question further, mob up to silence every proper argument. I'm done here, you won, enjoy! | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:54 | comment | added | user2371524 |
@Olaf he edited he was using C11 and getting the expected 4.14 now, which is impossible with C11, so this was clearly a typo meaning C++11. You're trying to catch every straw to somehow rectify your notorious wish to remove any C++ tag on a question that somehow contains C. By all means, stop this.
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Aug 1, 2017 at 17:50 | comment | added | too honest for this site | @FelixPalmen: None of the ones did provide any proof the question is in any way related to C++! I OTOH showed clear evidence OP is only osing C and not asking about C++. The only thing about C++ is the C++ tag. And that is well known to be a very weak indicator. OP even edited the question to make clear it is C; he did not add evidence he is using C++. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:49 | comment | added | user2371524 |
@Olaf no, it's your edits that violate site rules. The question was originally tagged with both tags and the OP clearly expected C++11 meaning of auto , so this was never just about C (and most probably by some person confused about the fact that they are different). Your edits actively do harm to the question, so stop it.
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Aug 1, 2017 at 17:48 | comment | added | too honest for this site | @FelixPalmen … the recent edits were actively trying to add C++ context the author clearly did not intend. I consider such edits actively and massively violating site-rules. If we now edit the question to match the answers, I definitively see the site at it's end. A site not following and enforcing its own rules, res. high-rep users ignoring these rules that clearly makes all rules ridiculous and pointless. That's chaos and not a site I will support any further. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:46 | comment | added | user2371524 | @Olaf it isn't a C only question and please stop editing it in the sense you want it to be while most others don't agree. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:44 | comment | added | too honest for this site | @FelixPalmen: I find the question how string theory works very interesting, too. Yet it is not a good match for this site. While that's an extreme, it points out that not every question we (maybe both) find interesting is well suited for this site. Nevertheless, I can accept the question in question as asked now: a C-only question. It is the double-tagging with C++. It is all about C only, no indication C++ is involved. If you think there should be a similar question about C++, why no ask/self-asnwer a question about C++? I'd be fine with that, too. … | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:34 | comment | added | user2371524 | ... and as such probably helpful to others as well. But I acknowledge, as pointed out in a different answer here, that the question title might impair this. As for how to act on questions, I like to think "If there's any doubt, better don't do anything" (apart from commenting for clarification, maybe). You seem to think "better try to fix a problem". But is there always a problem? | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:33 | comment | added | user2371524 | @Olaf It's good to finally see some explanation how you feel about this site. But I can't agree that the general quality is on a downswing, maybe because although there's a huge torrent of garbage questions, they are normally sorted out quickly. What do you think of the questions I put as examples in my answer here? "Low-quality" by site standards, still, they are a) old and b) well-received? I'd say they are good for the site. Do you disagree on this? I see the question under discussion here in a similar category, it doesn't meet the site standards, still it is about an interesting effect ... | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 17:27 | comment | added | too honest for this site | Ok, one last post: I certainly shows SO is well known. And If it is to be turned into a "ask anything" community, so be it. But I'm not willing to support this. Call me pretentious or elitist, but I don't see any use in programmers who lack basic search-skills or the ability to apply even the most simple concepts. In other worse: If that's what the community wants, I'm out. (And from the discussion at the question, I have a bad feeling about that). Users agreeing with me are welcome to keep quality high. We will see … … … | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:29 | comment | added | Steve Summit | @Olaf Thank you. I can't disagree with any of that. The quality of the questions on the C tag is abysmal, it's true, although I take comfort that it reflects the fact that SO is well publicized and has been found useful. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:27 | comment | added | too honest for this site | … who answer ever yet-so-simple typo question, just to gain reps (at least that's how it looks like). Maybe that's becaue we don't get reps for finding dupes which also often takes longer than a short answer. But that's indeed not how I see this site and what the rules state. I will think about my further contribution. As-is, I don't see much use and the C-tag (at least) quality clearly degrading. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:25 | history | edited | Steve Summit | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Aug 1, 2017 at 16:24 | comment | added | too honest for this site | As my last comment on this and a personal reply: I'd wish there were more answerable questions here. But quality on the C tag has decreased and questions are mostly about things better be read in a C book. Particular questions are not good to learn C. One need to get the whole picture and some of the fundamental concepts. There are in fact not that many. problem is a answer covering all aspects will be way too broad; remember we are not a tutoring site. I see a lot of other regulars/high rep users for the C (and the C++ tag) which are just tired of those reputation-hunters … | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:21 | comment | added | Steve Summit | @Olaf "People insist on using a C version which has been outdated 18 years ago". No. People insist on acknowledging the history of 18 years ago, and the effects it has on present-day practice. People insist on not insisting that 100.0% of all programmers remain 100.0% consistent with the most up-to-date-standards, 100.0% of the time. People insist on understanding that it may take some people more time to catch up to the most modern practice than others, sometimes for good reasons. People insist on remembering that backwards compatibility is important. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:20 | comment | added | too honest for this site | There has been enough help by the comments - as often for questions which are off-topic. While that's also - strictly speaking - against site-rules, it is tolerated practice. Nevertheless, those questions are closed, because they are indeed not good for the site. You alread mentioned, this site is not to help the askeer of a question (that's more of a side-effect), but to help others. If someone had wanted to help, two new questions, one for C and one for C++ should have been asked and self-answered. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:17 | comment | added | Steve Summit | @Olaf This isn't the place for a personal comment, but I don't know where is, so I'll say it here: You're very smart and knowledgeable about C (and perhaps C++ too, I don't know), and I respect that. I wish you'd spend more time answering questions, and less time criticizing the questions and answers of others. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:15 | comment | added | Steve Summit | @Olaf One of the fundamental underlying tensions is between helping people, and strictly obeying the rules of the site. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:12 | comment | added | too honest for this site | The actual problem is if questions like that should be answered at all or edited by answerers to suit their answer. I don#t think so. That's what close-votes are for. "Too broad" or "unclear" are fine. The question also lacked a mcve to show how the output was generated. That's three valid close-reasons. | |
Aug 1, 2017 at 16:10 | comment | added | too honest for this site |
You could blame K&R for the initial implicit int for declarations without a type. Or maybe, C99 for disallowing this as well. If I understand one of the comments at the original question comment correct, auto i = 10; has never been valid C++ (at least since its standardisation), so there is not ambiguity in C++. For C, the implicit int was a major flaw which has been corrected 18 years ago. We hardly use 10 year old phones, but to program our most modern systems, people insist on using a C version which has been outdated 18 years ago. Does not make sense to me.
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Aug 1, 2017 at 16:05 | history | edited | Steve Summit | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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Aug 1, 2017 at 15:48 | history | answered | Steve Summit | CC BY-SA 3.0 |