Timeline for What's too broad about "all the possible operations that could cause a NaN"?
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Jun 3, 2020 at 15:29 | history | edited | CommunityBot |
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Aug 27, 2014 at 11:31 | comment | added | l4mpi | @tmyklebu and the comment that flebool just left in reply to you on the original question pretty much confirms my view: "Many libraries return (or can return) nan under certain circumstances, defined by the library, instead of returning an exception for example. They are a finite but very large number of cases.". Do you still think anybody who might find this question somewhat broad doesn't know what floating-point numbers are or deliberately misinterprets the question? | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 11:19 | comment | added | l4mpi | @tmyklebu "[...] when he uses NumPy to do tons of machine arithmetic" is an unjustified assumption on your part. I'd even guess it's a false assumption; read the comment by flebool and OPs response: "causes of NAN [...] that do not originate from other libraries [than numpy/scipy]" - which I would interpret as OP wanting to know all numpy operations and library functions which could ever return a NAN; I think you agree that question is too broad. FWIW, I'd close the question as unclear until OP clarifies if he wants to know about IEEE754 operations, or about all of python and numpy. | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 10:39 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @user2357112: I jumped to the conclusion "The questioner wants to know why NaNs sometimes crop up when he uses NumPy to do tons of machine arithmetic." This still appears reasonable to me. (From all this discussion, I gather that the question can be interpreted in a "too broad" way. I still don't feel it's reasonable to do so, however, and I'm rather at a loss as to how to change the question's wording so that it's still useful to the same audience and is harder to misinterpret.) | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 10:31 | comment | added | user2357112 | @tmyklebu: How else? Well, by using NumPy. I don't know why you'd look at a Python question, think "Python likes to turn NaNs into exceptions", and jump to the conclusion "The questioner must be asking about machine-level floating-point operations" rather than "The questioner is using libraries that don't do that with NaNs". | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 10:22 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @user2357112: How else do you get a NaN without explicitly asking for one? Python likes turning invalid operations into Python exceptions (in a way not entirely consistent with IEEE 754). The poster modified his question to ask about NumPy instead of about straight Python in an apparent effort to "clarify" or "narrow" something I still don't see. | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 10:00 | comment | added | user2357112 |
@tmyklebu: What gave you the idea the question was about machine arithmetic? There is not a single reference to machine arithmetic in the title, body, or tags, in any of the question's four revisions. Somehow, you've gotten the idea that this question is something it's not. It's making you miss things like the exponentiation operator (** ), which is a common operation that produces NaNs, because you're thinking in a model where that's not an operator.
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Aug 27, 2014 at 9:55 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @user2357112: Probably because the question is about machine arithmetic. In any case, that's the first interpretation I can see that doesn't render the question universally useless. | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 9:07 | comment | added | user2357112 | @tmyklebu: What makes you think the questioner is referring to the IEEE 754 standard's use of the term "operation"? It's a NumPy/SciPy question; why not use the term as the NumPy and SciPy docs do? You will find that that documentation uses the term in a much broader way than what you have in mind. | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 9:03 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @user2357112: And, even if the question were "too broad" by the book, I can't support closing questions like this. It's an "if you knew how to phrase your question precisely, then you'd know where to look for the answer" question. Closing these for reasons other than "duplicate" does nobody any favours. | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 9:00 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @user2357112: I debunked that already. Go read the spec. The spec is the IEEE 754 standard. Look how it uses the word "operation." | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 8:59 | comment | added | user2357112 | @tmyklebu: You have an extremely restricted interpretation of "operation" that the actual question does not support. | |
Aug 27, 2014 at 8:54 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @user2357112: I debunked that already. Go read the spec. | |
Aug 26, 2014 at 23:30 | comment | added | user2357112 | "finite and documented amount of operations" - there's a finite, small, and documented number of operators, but operations? There is a crazy number of functions and classes and weird interactions that might produce NaNs, and more are invented constantly. | |
Aug 26, 2014 at 19:12 | vote | accept | tmyklebu | ||
Aug 26, 2014 at 18:56 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @Mysticial: I gather I shouldn't actually be trying to follow seemingly-insane advice dispensed here? | |
Aug 26, 2014 at 18:55 | comment | added | Mysticial | @tmyklebu Welcome to meta.SO. The mecca of pointless bickering over 1st world problems. | |
Aug 26, 2014 at 18:55 | comment | added | Unihedron | @tmyklebu Even then they're using the wrong close reason... | |
Aug 26, 2014 at 18:53 | comment | added | tmyklebu | @Mysticial: Is there even a rule against this question? All I've been able to get out of Servy is basically "I don't like questions that I don't understand." | |
Aug 26, 2014 at 18:43 | comment | added | Mysticial | At the risk of offending those who follow the rules to the word, I agree with this. Even if it is asking for a list, I see no harm if the list is short. There's only a few ways you can produce a NaN. | |
Aug 26, 2014 at 18:38 | history | answered | Unihedron | CC BY-SA 3.0 |