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May 23, 2017 at 12:37 history edited CommunityBot
replaced http://stackoverflow.com/ with https://stackoverflow.com/
Mar 20, 2017 at 10:32 history edited CommunityBot
replaced http://meta.stackexchange.com/ with https://meta.stackexchange.com/
May 29, 2014 at 8:08 comment added vascowhite I heard a phrase that struck a chord with me yesterday. Fraud Syndrome may explain why some people self assess as mediocre. It doesn't really add to this discussion, but struck me as interesting given @belacqua's phraseology.
May 29, 2014 at 6:15 comment added Fattie @belac - yes, for sure you're totally correct. That's an excellent point about individuals who self-assess as mediocre. Excellent. It's fascinating that people at the very top (of anything) are often dismissive about their own knowledge and-or talents. In any event, a reminder of how ridiculously important SO is to workflow todays.
May 28, 2014 at 20:51 comment added belacqua @JoeBlow I agree that things are unfair in the sense you're talking about; those who are borderline equipped (mentally et al.) at a relevant point in time aren't likely to be "great". Yet I think there is a huge amount achievable with targeted study & consistent practice. If deficits are large, the requisite work would sink anyone w/o another exceptional ability: determination, optimism, etc.. To your point, those who don't 'have it' are probably going to employ naive, unproductive study. Mentors, SO, etc. can help. One who self-assesses as mediocre is likely positioned to gain a lot.
May 28, 2014 at 4:56 comment added Fattie ...so for me I believe what i said in my first comment above. Anyway, all the more reason that professional engineering chat resources like SO are critically important; and I utterly agree with what you say about the critical importance of other's source code and so on. (Better and better programmers have more and more open midns, and want to see EVERYTHING.) So uh .. go, stackoverflow!
May 28, 2014 at 4:53 comment added Fattie Hi @belacqua. It's a tricky business. I have a feeling the world is very "unfair'. Consider what DVK said about singing voices: I wish it was true but it's the opposite of the truth. You either are Paul McCartney, Julie Andrews, Maria Callas .. or you're not. Certainly musicians practice basically all their waking lives, but that's even more tragic - all the #2 guitarists in the world practice 3000 hours a year, but they'll never ever be joe walsh, jimi hendrix .. or buckethead! Music and singing in particular is the ultimate example of "you have it or not, that's it."...
May 28, 2014 at 1:27 comment added belacqua @JoeBlow Tangent to your point, but a decent or better poetry/writing class and a decent or better programming course of study should have in common learning the tools, the craft, and looking at sources. You have a tricked-out brain, or you have inspiration, or ability, but what then? Here is where craft comes in: not all writers or programmers are clever, but if competent, they do know what goes where, and why. And 'source code': you can write/program without knowing how the best have done it, but looking at the best of the best (source, texts) is a great first (and 2nd, 3rd, ...) step.
May 20, 2014 at 19:58 comment added KevinDTimm @RoryAlsop - I couldn't disagree more, I can point out examples everywhere of people around me who can't program and can't be taught to program. And no, I'm not talking about people where I work who are employed as programmers :)
May 17, 2014 at 7:19 comment added HostileFork says dont trust SE @RoryAlsop I mostly agree, but there's something like an IQ test for programming. Jeff Atwood blogged about a programming aptitude test at one point. I don't think that says anything more about your ultimate abilities than an IQ test does, but it might measure how much of a challenge you're up against to learn something that doesn't naturally settle with your perceptual framework.
May 16, 2014 at 1:57 comment added DVK @JoeBlow - you can have a singing voice. But it needs to be trained to sing well. (having - in the past - a good singing talent - I can tell you there's a world of difference between someone with talent and someone with professional singing training). Same with programming. It's a combination of ability and learning.
May 16, 2014 at 1:56 comment added DVK @likejiujitsu - one of the best developers in our company has a Philosophy degree. To the best of my knowledge, he's fully self taught.
May 15, 2014 at 12:18 comment added vascowhite @JoeBlow I believe you can have an aptitude for programming, but it still needs to be learned. I know, I have put a lot of effort into learning over the past 34 years, from basic to Z80 assembler to Pascal and many others. It is important to have the right mindset though, many people couldn't think logically if their lives depended on it.
May 15, 2014 at 10:41 comment added Rory Alsop Joe - nonsense. Programming is absolutely not an inbuilt skill. It is almost the opposite. You can have an aptitude for analytics, or structured thought, but anyone can be taught programming. At any age.
May 15, 2014 at 10:11 comment added Fattie @vasco makes an outstanding point that SO is about specialities. I have vast knowledge about iOS [which is a stupid waste of time, by the way] but I am only able to answer a few microscopic specialities within that. Well said, vasco.
May 15, 2014 at 10:09 comment added Fattie No programmers are "self-taught". It's an in-built skill like singing, or being tall. You either have it or not. You can no more "learn" programming than you can "learn" to be sexy or "learn" to sing. (Regarding programming "courses" - it's risible. Like "creative writing" courses for people who "want to be poets" - staggeringly stupid.) PHP is not programming, that's just scripting. (Just teasing there, bro :) All programming "languages" are the same, of course.)
May 14, 2014 at 22:08 comment added likejudo "I am self taught and have no formal training of any kind whatsoever in computer related fields" wow, that is an inspiration!
May 14, 2014 at 21:41 history answered vascowhite CC BY-SA 3.0