13

Recently the [sap] tag was marked as invalid with which I do not fully agree. There are a bunch of questions already tagged with it which are probably not worth retagging, but the future of the tag should be discussed.

The argument used by the last editor of the tag information is:

This tag is invalid since "SAP" is neither a programming language nor a single product but a software company

which, indeed, is true, however, does not fully reflect the reality. More than 80% of the newcomers that use this tag have SAP R/3 and its successors (ECC, S/4HANA) on mind, and this is quite logical, because this is the most used and famous product of the company.

However, another significant meaning of this tag is its software ecosystem, i.e. the set of business appliances, technologies and tools related to the company software and its users, similar to how Python or MySQL refers to not only Python Software Foundation or MySQL AB, but also to a Python ecosystem or a MySQL ecosystem.

Why should Oracle, the main SAP competitor, have its own tag on Stack Overflow, and SAP shouldn't?

The proposal is to leave [sap] tag as an alias to [sap-r3] and as an umbrella tag for all the [sap-r3] related technologies. For all other SAP products to use dedicated tags: [sap-cloud-platform], [sap-successfactors], [sap-web-ide], etc.

10
  • 1
    The Oracle tag is supposed to only refer to a single product. See also meta.stackoverflow.com/q/377079/6083675
    – Laurel
    Oct 16, 2020 at 16:01
  • 14
    The presence of other tags that may violate a rule is not a good argument for allowing a tag that violates that rule to remain. Oct 16, 2020 at 16:03
  • 7
    That's quite the tree of [sap] tags.. Can't leaves those alone; I'm sycamore and more of them being created constantly.. (Sorry)
    – Caius Jard
    Oct 16, 2020 at 16:05
  • 5
    [sap] and [abap] are healthy, use product tags and you're guaranteed to not get an answer. So that's pretty bad advice. Oct 16, 2020 at 16:15
  • 14
    "Why Oracle, the main SAP competitor, has own tag on SO, and SAP shouldn't?" And from that tag;s description "Oracle Database is a Multi-Model Database Management System created by Oracle Corporation. Do NOT use this tag for other products owned by Oracle, such as Java and MySQL." Clearly Oracle (the company) does not have it's own tag. Much like microsoft does not.
    – Thom A
    Oct 16, 2020 at 16:34
  • 3
    The situation with [sap] tag is exactly the same as with [oracle]: I don't think people will use [oracledb] or [oracle-server] or even [oracle-rdbms] because most oracle folks think that [oracle] means the database and the solution supposedly should be the same as for oracle, and that's what I proposed in the question
    – Suncatcher
    Oct 17, 2020 at 14:51
  • 3
    More punny-compliant: "Should we zap the [sap] tag?" Jan 10, 2021 at 17:33
  • 2
    Better title: Tag discussions [sap] my will to live ;). Jan 11, 2021 at 13:23
  • Even then, if it points to both sap & sap R/3, that makes it a meta-tag, and inappropriate for use, per the tag wiki, no?
    – Nate T
    Jun 8, 2021 at 7:42
  • @Caius that's an old chestnut, you have gone barking
    – MT1
    May 11, 2023 at 5:35

5 Answers 5

14

To help people choose the right SAP tag for their question, below is a hierarchy of these tags and the corresponding number of questions as of today (mainly as of October 17th, 2020).

I turned it into a Community Answer to encourage people to maintain it and use this list.

To discover new SAP questions, use or customize this tagset which includes all the tags below.
(Bookmark this community wiki instead of the above link as its URL can be changed by other contributors of this wiki.)

(6161)


(Missing tag) == Feel free to create the tag when asking related questions. If your reputation is lower than 1500, let us know in the comment section below.

5
  • Based on this list, if we removed the sap tag you'd be unlikely to find the actual tag you need if you just type sap into the box - there are just too many possibilities. Feb 1, 2021 at 4:12
  • @MarkRansom Could you give an example? Where did you have issues finding the right tag? Feb 1, 2021 at 5:33
  • @BoghyonHoffmann I'm just saying there are a lot of tags that begin with or contain "sap". I haven't tried it myself to see what actually happens because I have no personal interest in the tag. Feb 1, 2021 at 16:39
  • 3
    @MarkRansom Generally, we (SE users) want to encourage or even push question authors to research before asking any questions. And researching includes also finding out beforehand what product / technology / topic the question is about. The topic shouldn't be just "sap" as mentioned by answers here. Once the topic is clear, it's fairly easy to just type the name in the box and to select the right tag. I see no problems so far. But of course, if anyone else has a problem, we're always open to improve Feb 1, 2021 at 19:12
  • @BoghyonHoffmann despite the large number of knowledgeable people in this thread, I still think a lot of people would associate the company SAP with the product that established them without being aware of their other offerings. But that's just a personal opinion and I'm not in a position to judge the accuracy of it. Feb 1, 2021 at 19:35
22

I am an SAP employee and to me this tag is ambiguous, but I do understand where you are coming from. SAP R/3 / ECC / S/4HANA are colloquially referred to as SAP. However, that is not the correct name of the product, technology stack, programming language or software component. It is the name of the company that offers a variety of products.

If you want to have a tag encompassing our 3 main products you could call it (which already exists by the way) but what would be the purpose of such tag? Instead please tag with the correct product you are using and the programming language (e.g. ABAP). It would be better to use tags , (non-existent) or .

For what it's worth you might actually get a better response when you ask at https://answers.sap.com

These tags are not highly moderated. It's unlikely that we will do any clean up any time soon. For the time being the will stay but you should consider using the correct tag instead. This is more important when asking about SAPUI5 or some other product of our company. Don't use the company tag!

is not to be used when asking about any Oracle product. It's the name of their database and it should be used only when asking about Oracle DB.

6

I just found a related question Burninate this tag a[sap] which concerns the tag, asked 3 years ago. There's an attempt to generalize it to make it valid for all "company tags", but it still remains specific to the SAP tag.

I prefer not tagging this current question as duplicate because I think it's worth discussing it again today.

The most-voted-so-far answer from Shog9 says:

"If everyone (within some small margin of error) refers to SAP ERP as "SAP", then the tag is both descriptive and unambiguous."
...
"Completely removing the tag from the system when nearly everyone using it agrees on what it means... Is counter-productive"

So, 3 years ago, some people considered that the tag was not ambiguous, and this year, few people forced their views to make the tag ambiguous.

Today, maybe the majority of SAP professionals at Stack Overflow think that the tag is ambiguous.

Personally, as a SAP professional for 20 years, I saw the SAP products evolve dramatically. While the ERP solution still remains the flagship product, many other ones are well known, like the CRM solution, SAP GUI Scripting, RFC SDK, SAPUI5, Fiori, SAP Gateway, Cloud, etc.

Today, my opinion is that the tag is ambiguous and should be made obsolete. I can't automatically think that a question tagged sap is about the ERP solution anymore.

It's not a problem to me of having a long favorite URL to display all questions related to my SAP knowledge: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/abap+or+opensql+or+rtts+or+alv+or+badi+or+function-module+or+bapi+or+cds+or+sap-basis+or+saprfc+or+sap-dotnet-connector+or+jco+or+sapjco3+or+pyrfc+or+sap-dotnet-connector+or+sap-data-dictionary+or+idoc+or+sap-bw+or+sap-bsp+or+webdynpro+or+sap-gateway+or+dynpro+or+s4hana+or+sap-erp+or+sap-r3+or+sap-hr+or+sap-crm+or+sap-bw+or+sap-gui+or+hana+or+hana-sql-script+or+netweaver+or+sapscript+or+sap?tab=Newest.

  • I'd like to get rid of the sap tag. I currently re-tag all new questions with a more specific tag (for instance, I re-tagged the latest question about SAP archiving)
  • NB: by the way, that's not the question but I'm skeptical concerning the need of keeping the tag (a solution stack), the need of having multiple version-specific tags for the ERP product (, , ), as most of the questions are valid for all versions, and the tag is used incorrectly by 95% of people instead of for SAP GUI Scripting (there are only 10 questions tagged , so I'd opt to remove the tag, people could use instead).

But I see a problem for people searching answers by entering the tag, which doesn't prevent the sap tag to be made ambiguous, but users may suffer from a lack of assistance in searching. For instance:

  • The general search field doesn't propose the possible tags, and it doesn't indicate that the entered tag is ambiguous while typing:
    Stack Overflow search field
  • It's indicated only after pressing Enter but I'm afraid it's not visible enough to catch people attention, and the substitutes are not proposed:
    Stack Overflow alternatives to ambiguous tag?
  • And while asking the question, it's visible that [sap] should not be used, but latest questions prove that people still use it, and the substitutes are not proposed:
    Stack Overflow tag assistant for ambiguous tags?

So, I would keep ambiguous but would complete the tag description with "(for instance , , , , , etc.)"

PS: To help discuss the SAP tags, I created a separate answer listing all of them and the corresponding number of questions as of today. By the way, I didn't find such a hierarchy of tags at Stack Overflow, that would help to know what the possible tags are....

4
  • It's not a problem to me of having a long favorite URL to display all questions related to my SAP knowledge: unlikely I will be always use this lengthy link, so I will be missing probably interesting questions. However, subscription to [sap] tag and receiving mail notifications makes it all, its all-in-one solution
    – Suncatcher
    Oct 17, 2020 at 14:55
  • 2
    That would be cool to invent the, let say, "hyper tags": have [sap] as a hyper tag which can be used only to search, not to tag a question. The [sap] tag could be assigned hyponym tags, and these tags could themselves be assigned other hyponym tags, to form the hierarchy of tags I proposed for instance. Oct 17, 2020 at 15:48
  • About 30% out of your SAP tags tree was created by me during my work on categorization of questions :) And even after that I consider general [sap] tag should exist
    – Suncatcher
    Oct 17, 2020 at 19:04
  • 1
    Btw.: the long URL will fail for unlogged / anonymous users (apparently to prevent DDoS). Alternatively, a tagset can be created. Also the [sap] tag info now includes the link to the tag tree. Feb 2, 2021 at 10:20
5

Author of the edit 7 here. When reviewing questions, compared to other specified tags like , I often notice the following pattern:

  • Question authors are unsure which SAP products / technology stack they're actually using. E.g. this question mentions only "SAP Web" (What is SAP Web?). Such lack of details led to downvotes, Q&A-ping-pong in the comment section, and/or closing the question altogether.
  • General SAP questions tend to be too broad to answer or attract opinionated answers / spams.

In addition to all the great answers here, I'd like to emphasize that "SAP" cannot be associated with "R/3" or "ERP" alone anymore. SAP is changing. They're betting high on C/4HANA and UX nowadays while incrementally embracing or even contributing to open standards / open source solutions unlike 10 years ago. SAP is trying hard to break the image that "SAP" == that outdated software from the 1970s/80s which has weirdly tons of features for all sorts of users doing almost everything (mostly referring to SAP GUI). One of the first steps to get rid of that image is to educate people that "SAP" is not a software but a company that also has other solutions / products and that the software packages they're using have names.

We should, however, discuss how to effectively follow SAP related questions without the [sap] tag.


In order to answer the question "What should we do with the [sap] tag?", here is my proposal:

Goal

  • Discourage use of [sap]. Ultimately, [sap] should be banned — same as other company tags like [google], [apple], or [microsoft].
  • At the same time, keep the possibility to easily discover and follow SAP related questions.

Process

Status Task Comments
✔️ Kick-start: change the tag info. After the change (mid 2020), people seem to use it significantly less. Still, new users tend to overlook the wiki excerpt.
✔️ Start reviewing 6k [sap] questions: retag, edit, vote, close, â€Ĥ Help wanted! Also I'd like to encourage downvoting and closing. It is not shaming the author but helping them!
✔️ Document all existing SAP tags. Created a community wiki for that (Thanks Sandra Rossi!) which is also linked from the [sap] tag wiki for assistance.
✔️ Create a tagset to help discovering new SAP questions. Added to the community wiki. Includes questions from all other SE sites. You can also fork it and customize its filter rules.
Merge / synonymize applicable tags according to guidelines. Currently, there are too many SAP tags some of which are unnecessarily specific. We should try to reduce the tag tree.
Rename ambiguous tags (E.g. [jco] to [sap‑jco]). Improve tag name consistency and identifying new SAP software questions (e.g. if someone searches by [sap-*]).
Finally, request burninating and banning [sap] altogether.

In order to help following SAP questions easily, I created a tagset with the following filter rules:

Filter rules of SAP questions tagset


Proposed guidelines for creating new SAP tags

Due to the high number of existing SAP tags, some of which are already too fragmented / too specific, we have to be very strict when it comes to creating another SAP-related tag in order to keep SAP tags manageable and to make following SAP topics less cumbersome. We're in the process of reducing the tree. If you intend to create yet another tag related to SAP, please follow the guidelines below in addition to general guidelines.

General guidelines from Stack Overflow

Tags are a means of connecting experts with questions they will be able to answer by sorting questions into specific, well-defined categories. [â€Ĥ] As a general rule, you should avoid creating new tags if possible. (Source)

[â€Ĥ] You should always favor existing tags; only create new tags when you feel you can make a strong case that your question does cover a new topic that nobody else has asked about before on this site. [...] Please create new tags responsively! (Source)

In some cases, tags that are subsets of other tags will also be considered synonyms. (Source)

Enhanced guidelines for SAP related topics

(I.e. in addition to general guidelines above)

Create the tag only if all of the following apply:

  • The topic has its own official documentation, product landing page, or a GitHub repository maintained by SAP. Or it has its own Wikipedia article such as BAPI.

  • The topic is worth mentioning in your CV.

  • The tag covers mainly programming aspects of the topic.
    If the question is generally about setup, infrastructure, license, or administration problems of SAP products, ask at community.sap.com instead.

  • The topic is not an integral element of a closely-related technical topic of which the tag already exists. If the existing tag typically covers that element already in practice, avoid creating a new tag but favor the existing tag — unless the existing tag is too broad.

    • For example: there is little value in having [abap-internal-tables] as a separate tag, which is equivalent to having [javascript-arrays] next to .
      But does not include since the former tag is already quite broad.
    • General guidelines from Stack Overflow strongly suggest that we should be sparing with tags and that we should favor existing tags.

The above proposed guidelines were discussed preliminarily in the chat room (shortly). I'm open for more discussion. Feel free to up/downvote this answer to indicate whether the community agrees or not with the proposals here.

5
  • Question authors are unsure which SAP products / technology stack they're actually using very good point. That's why some umbrella lifering tag should exist for such users
    – Suncatcher
    Jan 11, 2021 at 8:38
  • 1
    @Suncatcher There are certainly advantages of having such an "umbrella" tag. Unfortunately, I also see that the mere existence of the [sap] tag encourages askers not to specify any further, using the vague term "SAP" constantly. Jan 11, 2021 at 8:48
  • @Suncatcher Would the suggested tagset help you to find new SAP questions? Jan 21, 2021 at 13:14
  • Cool! I believe it will work
    – Suncatcher
    Jan 21, 2021 at 13:15
  • 1
    @Suncatcher Glad to hear that. You can also customize the filter rules and email notifications however you want (after logging in). Thanks for the feedback! Jan 21, 2021 at 13:17
3

There already seems to be a fairly widespread consensus that most company-specific tags like this should go. See, for example, this Q&A on blacklisting the Apple and Microsoft tags. (One admitted counterexample is the cisco tag).

I fully agree with this tag being ambiguous. It's being used to refer to all kinds of different products, which greatly diminishes its usefulness.

One thing that does give me at least some pause is the fact that some high-rep users are posting lots of answers in this tag. (One 12k user has posted 377 answers in this tag). It would be worth investigating whether it's helping them find questions to answer. If not, the tag should really be burninated.

2
  • 2
    Said user haven't answered a question on sap since '18.
    – Braiam
    Oct 16, 2020 at 18:42
  • 1
    @Braiam Eh, get rid of it then (unless someone else is answering questions in the tag). Oct 16, 2020 at 19:13

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .