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I believe that it is part of the Stack Exchange philosophy that votes can be placed without any explanatory comment, and that this is as it should be. Even so, it is very common to see a plea for unattributed downvotes to be explained.

It would help a lot if there was citable canon that explained this, as I am certain that, without it, demands that dissenters explain themselves will persist.

I am asking whether there is already documentation that fits the bill and, if not, whether the community agrees with me that it should be written.

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    "without it, demands that dissenters explain themselves will persist." - I believe this will persist anyways, no matter what you do.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 13:27
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    @l4mpi: Probably. Although my hope is that, if it were properly documented, the incidence may at least decrease.
    – Borodin
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 13:30
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    Here is a nice canonical question from the Overmeta. Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 13:46
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    @Becuzz, I'm afraid that also won't work, because such comments have a tendency to get upvoted. The net effect is that the commenter feels encouraged to continue doing that, even if there is no response. Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 16:06
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    @FrédéricHamidi: Precisely. And pointing out that it's not in the spirit of Stack Exchange just results in an attack from a mob with pitchforks who haven't grasped that SE isn't a forum. I think that the only thing that will change people's minds is a written rule that says that such comments are undesirable.
    – Borodin
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 16:13
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    It's "common" knowledge on meta that downvotes mean disagreement. Yet, users who are not new to the site, but new to meta, frequently ask "why the downvotes?" on here. It's obvious that documentation won't help.
    – user3920237
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 17:56
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    @CodeCaster Sad but true. By far the most effective way to increase the score of a low quality post is to downvote it when it's at 0. It tends to increase the post's score more than upvoting it would, at least if the question has been active recently.
    – Servy
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 17:56
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    @FrédéricHamidi I think that my canonical beats your canonical: "The answer was down voted because I lost my keys. Please, stay with me, let me explain..." :)
    – gnat
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 18:25
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    I completely disagree, if you're going to downvote something, you should comment on why you downvoted it. I don't like asking what seems like a perfectly valid question (and I don't ask questions without trying to find the answer first) only to have it downvoted without reason. How can I fix the question or understand or fix what I'm doing in the future unless I have this information? It's utterly exasperating and unhelpful, far more unhelpful than the question, to downvote without explanation. Seriously, it drives me insane. Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:25
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    @Sephethus Downvoting a bad post, with or without a comment, is one of the single most useful contributions someone can make. Preventing people from using a harmful answer, and knowing that it's not a good solution, is one of the greatest contributions that you can make. As much as it's not enjoyable to get a downvote that you don't understand, it is absolutely helpful. You as a poster need to have the ability to reflect on your post and consider what problems it might have (you'd be surprised how often you will catch your own mistakes), but at the end of the day, the vote isn't for you.
    – Servy
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:32
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    @Sephethus the purpose of a downvote goes far beyond informing the person asking the question.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:37
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    @Sephethus If I'm downvoting a question then I'm telling everyone else that it's not worth their time to go read it, I'm (potentially) allowing the system to delete the question if the author isn't able to improve it, and to inhibit their ability to ask more questions if they continue to make the same mistakes over and over again. There is tons and tons of information about how to ask a quality question, and lots of resources there for people actively searching for how to improve. There are way too many bad questions to hold the hand of every help vampire.
    – Servy
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:38
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    @Sephethus Yes, you are expected to be able to evaluate your own question to be sure it meets the site's standards. I'm well aware that it's not easy, but it's the only realistic possibility. If you want to get a quality answer, you need to take the time to write a quality question. If someone is feeling charitable they may help you out, but there just aren't enough people capable of fixing up every single bad post for there to be an expectation of that happening. Preventing the downvotes would only serve to prevent you from even knowing that you did something wrong, let alone what.
    – Servy
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:44
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    Look at it this way. I don't downvote to tell the question asker that their question has a problem, i downvote to tell the SO system that this question doesn't need to appear on the front page because something is wrong with it. Leaving a comment in that scenario doesn't help the target of my action. If i wish to help the asker, i'll leave a comment directed at the asker. Sometimes, i don't want to help the asker or don't feel i have enough time to provide the help that would be required.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 20:34
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    @Sephethus If you're regularly finding yourself thinking that a question is a quality question, despite the fact that it is attracting downvotes, then it's a pretty strong sign that your standards for quality are simply a lot lower than the rest of the community members, or that you value various qualities differently, and you'll need to take that into consideration when evaluating question to try to more closely emulate questions that are received better. Once again, the downvote isn't there just for you; it's for everyone else.
    – Servy
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 20:38

3 Answers 3

3

Downvoters should not have to explain themselves.

They really shouldn't, and this topic has been beaten to death.

OP's should be able to ask for an explanation of downvotes

Why should a poster not be able to comment "Can the downvoter please clarify their position?" or similar? If they are not able to see the issue with their post, then they are only asking for the exact problem which led to the downvote so they can either fix it (or often delete it once they understand). Further, it is possible that the explanation doesn't even come from the downvoter. Either way, none of this places the actual onus on the downvoter, because they in no way are required to respond to these comments nor does anyone even know they were the one who posted the downvote.

The downvoter should not have the "authority" to prevent user comments

In my opinion, that one user should have "authority" over the subject matter of another user's comments solely based on the fact they downvoted their post is ludicrous. While certain users may respond with a hostile comment asking for an explanation, that just makes them easier to ignore. In no way does that mean that every user should be prevented from asking for explanations.

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  • I feel like your first and second point kind-of contradict. We agree that "downvoters should not have to explain themselves" , but it's fine if OP asks for downvoters to explain themselves??!? I think the whole issue is that it currently is happening , and the noise about downvotes is an issue Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 18:48
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    @Coffee - I don't see a contradiction. Is it required for a downvoter to explain themselves? No. Are Op's banned from asking for downvote explanations? No.
    – Travis J
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 18:51
  • Right, but i mean... this is the status quo. And OP sees that the "downvote-noise" is enough of a problem that he made a post titled "Authority to downvote without comment" ... Apparently some people feel that their downvote-power is limited. Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 18:53
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    Saying "Downvoters, explain?" rings hostility, not humility to me. As you said, it's been beaten to death that downvotes happen and are expected if one is to participate on this site. If one has been participating on the site long enough and still can't accept downvotes with humility, then a response is not dignified.
    – user3920237
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 18:55
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    @remyabel - Fully agree that some people are hostile with their comments. But in those scenarios it is even easier to ignore them :) I just don't see why everyone should be prevented from asking because some users are not willing to make corrections or remove their incorrect content.
    – Travis J
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:01
  • @Coffee - No user should have the authority over another user's comment ability based on casting a downvote.
    – Travis J
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:02
  • @TravisJ - Fine, agreed. So .. status quo I guess? Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:31
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    Downvotes without comment shouldn't be allowed if there have not been any prior downvotes or comments. Downvoting a new question makes the probability of a solution decrease exponentially. I think if you're going to downvote a question you should bear a responsibility to explain what's wrong with the question and to remove your downvote if your criticisms are properly addressed with an edit.
    – Hack-R
    Commented Dec 20, 2015 at 22:49
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The rule is that a downvote has not to be explained (nor is an upvote). I sometimes saw comments asking for reasons, and at best I saw other comments beginning with "I didn't downvote but ..." meaning that another guy decided to explain, what he could have done even without the request.

Users regularily using SO know that (I'm not that old here and do know it). Adding a documentation on that will mainly be read by them (those who already know) where the users asking for explainations on downvotes will only eventually find it after someone show them the doc - If they had read the documentation on SO, they will probably have not been downvoted or could understand why (I know not always but often :-) )

My position is :

  • no reason to add more documention to the existing pages
  • the general rule should be to delete such comment as noisy
  • when a question or an answer has flaws in it, there should be comments on that independantly of the downvotes - it was the case on almost all the posts I saw
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    Why comment more when the mouse over for the down vote explains it sufficiently? Wouldn't that be noisy too?
    – user289086
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 18:03
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    @MichaelT - Yea but nobody reads those mouse-overs . That is very web 1.0 feature Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 18:46
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    I read the mouseovers, it says "This question does not show any research effort; it is unclear or not useful." That means when I get downvoted, I look for that, and when I don't find anything that doesn't show research, doesn't show usefulness or is unclear, then I assume I'm just being trolled by a jerk. Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:32
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    @Sephethus - Good to know you have the right attitude :-) Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:35
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I completely disagree, if you're going to downvote something, you should be required to enter an explanation. Otherwise you're just trolling. I don't like asking what seems like a perfectly valid question (and I don't ask questions without trying to find the answer first) only to have it downvoted without reason. How can I fix the question or understand or fix what I'm doing in the future unless I have this information? It's utterly frustrating on an exasperating level, and it's unhelpful. It is far more unhelpful than the question itself, to downvote without explanation. It might as well be considered an abuse.

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    The main point is that ... sometimes questions are so terrible that we'd really desire our unchecked powpow downvote powers. Otherwise ,we'd see a marked drop in downvotes and a marked drop in garbage-questions being dropped-off-front-page. So... a necessary evil if you will Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:33
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    And I don't like cluttering comments when I just agree with another user's comment. I downvote the Question/Answer and upvote the comment.
    – ryanyuyu
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:34
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    And I don't like cluttering comments when I just agree with another user's comment. I downvote the Question/Answer and upvote the comment.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:36
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    If I spent 3 hours researching and then ask a freaking question only to have it downvoted for no reason, that's incredibly, outrageously frustrating. I think my question is very well researched, very clear and very helpful and people are downvoting it and killing my rep and the chances that my question will be answered. I'd better damn well get a helpful explanation so I can fix it. Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:38
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    Though off-topic, your "outrage" so to speak demonstrates that you would not respond kindly to a downvoter's explanation.
    – user3920237
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:40
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    @Sephethus You are obligated to ask a quality question. The site is not obligated to help you turn your lackluster question into a quality question. The site isn't even capable of sorting out which questions are good and which aren't even without helping every single bad question get fixed up.
    – Servy
    Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 19:41
  • Your frustration and exasperation with the deduction of an imaginary internet point is completely within your control. I recently had a 2+ year old answer receive a downvote. I looked at the answer, and while it was not my best, it was good enough. I didn't freak out over the fact that the voter did not comment, because frankly, it's not that important to me if everyone finds my answer (or question) useful. Just that someone does. Commented Jan 28, 2015 at 21:55
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    I agree that comments should be required. I don't understand why a majority of guys smarter than me or you don't agree. I liken it to a drive by shooting. I think some guys down-vote just because they are reputation whores and you're question didn't lend itself to a quick answer. But I can't prove that.
    – toddmo
    Commented Jan 30, 2017 at 23:22
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    The defenders of anonymous downvotes seem to always assume that the downvote is warranted. I have no reason to believe that. Often when my stuff is downvoted it gives the impression of someone thinking "that's a dumb question for which I know the answer or would immediately know how to search Google for the answer." That doesn't mean it's obvious to me, or that I know how to find the answer elsewhere. It's also demoralizing in that I sense (may be wrong) that a single downvote can move the question to a limbo state where nobody else will ever see it.
    – Mastiff
    Commented Jul 9, 2021 at 17:42
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    Exactly on the nose. It’s pretentious, a lot like Apple snobs on their forums who balk at any suggestion that things should be otherwise or to suggest that there might be a problem with the OS or that my question might be valid. To add to your point, the possibility exists, quite often, that searching for the answer yielded nothing for me but may yield something for someone else. Maybe the search terms were just slightly different enough to matter. It’s always hard sometimes to figure out the proper words to use when searching for a solution. Commented Jul 10, 2021 at 20:10

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